So I think time has come to take this guy to court. Never done this before, hoping to get some feedback.

 

Client wasn't paying me for the website I did for him. He signed a contract, I completed the work. He stopped payment.

 

I took the site down which prompted him to negociate a deal. I accepted to hand over the site for £700 (half up front, half on completion). This was all agreed via email between me and his assistant.

 

He paid the first half, I handed the site over and sent him the second invoice (for the remaining £350). The invoice was sent by post using my accounting software (quickfile.co.uk). When the invoice was 10 days over the due date, I emailed him the invoice and let him know it was overdue.

 

He emailed me back, apologizing, saying he would send the cheque straight away and asking who to make the cheque out to (there was previous confusion over my name). I responded 3 days later. No response. 11 days later, I sent him another email asking if he had sent it yet. No answer.

 

So now it's over a month past due date.

 

What do I do?

He paid the first half, I handed the site over and sent him the second invoice

 

Never hand the site over before receiving the final payment.

 

All you can do is take him to small claims. Before you do, write him a stern letter and send it by recorded delivery. In the letter put exactly what terms of the contract he has broken and how you would like this rectified. Include a copy of the signed contract. Also state what you will do (solicitor, court etc) if the issue isn't resolved within 14 days.

Be firm yet polite. Also keep a copy of the letter for yourself.

Tried calling him? E-mails aren't always the most responsive and are fairly easy to ignore. Pick up the phone and ring him directly. Tell him that you've sent him emails and that you're just chasing up all unpaid invoices.

Never hand the site over before receiving the final payment.

 

I hear ya, I figured 50% upfront 50% after was good enough. But really the burden was on him and I see that now.

 

The agreement that was violated was the settlement, not the initial contract. Should I include copies of the emails detailing the settlement (instead of a copy of the contract) in my stern letter?

 

 

@Jason Dexter

 

Funny you should say. I stopped talking to the guy over the phone due to his rudeness and persistent attempts to manipulate me (took me a while to identify the red flags...). He is well aware he owes me money.

i think you are developer if yes then you know better than others.

What does that even mean?

Thumbs up for that theme, love it

Yup, time to send a strongly-worded letter stating that:

1. He is infringing on your copyright by using a stolen design, and
   
2. That you will be taking him to court unless the full amount is paid immediately.
   

Don't forget that you're entitled to charge interest at 8.5% from the day he went overdue, plus a fixed fee of £40 toward your recovery costs as per the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act - so when you take it to court, make sure it's calculated up to date - and don't accept anything less from him than the full sum including the £40 and the interest up to the day he pays.

You spoke to his assitant and not the client E.g. the person paying you

 

The company pays me, not the person (he's not a sole trader). His assistant legally represented the company as I see it. Am I wrong?

 

You accepted a weird "in between" deal - why? You had originally agreed 50/50 - why make things complicated?

 

The "wierd in between deal" was the 50/50. The deal let him off a few hundred quid which I thought was better than the effort involved in taking him to court. As for it being 50% up front, 50% after... this is similar to how I usually do things, obviously if he has already failed the initial contract the burden should be on him to pay 100% of the deal upfront. I know that now. I was naive.

 

Accpeting a cheque for an overdue invoice - come on

 

I'm learning...

 

All this seems to have happened by email only - you should have called as soon as the invoice was overdue

 

Communications between me and him really weren't working over the phone. I felt it safer to only use email, which provide legal evidence.

 

• For sanity's sake, try a final call - explicitly say "the invoice is now overdue and needs to be paid immediately to avoid further debt collection action"
  
• If you get no luck with the final call, disable his website and emails - if you've handed over the site without final payment and don't directly control the hosting yourself then I give you - more the fool you to be honest
  
• Notify him by letter of the action you'll be taking
  
• 9 times out of ten the above will work and the client will call up to pay
  

As you're using Wordpress, you could also switch his site theme to http://crumbs.thathurtabit.com/wp/ - assumes you have some sort of control over the hosting though.

 

Never ever provide a client with the final goods until they have paid up front. I personally don't even accept cheques anymore - bank transfer or cash. Keep things simple to avoid sorry situationjs like the one you have got yourself (yes, yourself ...) into.

 

I'm well aware of the situation I've got myself (yes, myself...) into and how it happened. Maybe I should have stated that first. Just trying to correct the situation as best I can. I may well follow your advice and call him up now. Thanks. And that crumbs theme is awesome I may have access to the site, I haven't tried. Is it really a good idea to take down the site at this stage from a legal perspective?

 

 

Yup, time to send a strongly-worded letter stating that:

1. He is infringing on your copyright by using a stolen design, and
    
   
2. That you will be taking him to court unless the full amount is paid immediately.
   

Don't forget that you're entitled to charge interest at 8.5% from the day he went overdue, plus a fixed fee of £40 toward your recovery costs as per the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act - so when you take it to court, make sure it's calculated up to date - and don't accept anything less from him than the full sum including the £40 and the interest up to the day he pays.

 

I may do this after I speak to him over the phone.

 

Thanks to everyone for the comments and advice, I really appreciate it. I'm learning

 

Will update when I have news.

well.

 

Just called him up. He complained about me calling him at 8:30 in morning. lol!

 

I asked him if he had sent me a cheque yet.

 

He hung up.

 

 

Should I gave him 24 hours before sending him a letter then?

Just power read this thread. You admitted you made the mistake by offering half the payment and in return you handed over the site. Yes he is being unreasonable and aint gonna pay the rest, but not worth persuing. At least you got something from him. One thing I have learnt, never sue a moron (enter your own swaering reference to suit!) even over £350. Take it on the chin as a lesson learnt.

 

However, if you have the upperhand of hosting the site, couldn't you sell the domain name or change the FTP settings so he can't upload it? If he comes back and has a problem, you can say 'where's my money then?'. Thats what I would do though lol. Don't try this at home kids!

Just power read this thread. You admitted you made the mistake by offering half the payment and in return you handed over the site. Yes he is being unreasonable and aint gonna pay the rest, but not worth persuing. At least you got something from him. One thing I have learnt, never sue a moron (enter your own swaering reference to suit!) even over £350. Take it on the chin as a lesson learnt.

 

However, if you have the upperhand of hosting the site, couldn't you sell the domain name or change the FTP settings so he can't upload it? If he comes back and has a problem, you can say 'where's my money then?'. Thats what I would do though lol. Don't try this at home kids!

 

Some really bad advice.

 

Do not just take it on the chin, do your best to take this guy down otherwise he could do it all over again to some other poor mug for more. Taking it on the chin is never really an option unless you were uncontracted and even then verbal goes some way to being a contract.

 

Again, don't do anything to antagonise the situation, in fact do quite the opposite, be as helpful and as approachable as possible. Never use any threatening or abusive behaviour/language as this would count against you in court. As Renaissance said above, you're now able to charge fees and interest on top of the remaining amount, which is enforceable by law.

 

It's time to move on to the stern letter.

Guys!

 

He hasn't changed the password on the wordpress admin. I still have access!

 

• Should I take the site down?

 

• Should I just change the password and leave the site up?

 

• Should I leave it as it is?

 

 

MikeChipshop, I like your view of things. But would this change things for you?

So long as you work within viable reason you should be fine.

You'll need to make sure what ever.action you take is justified by the amount owed to you.

 

What I'd would be, go in there and change the password/uninstall the the theme you created. Make sure not to touch anything else he may have created, this means custom menus that where not a part of your original design etc.

The idea is not to cause any damage or distress to the client as this can be used to counter any legal action. Once you've done this, put it in the handwritten letter you send to the client via special delivery, making not of the date ad time at which you carried out the action, state (again) the reason why and state (again) the actions needed to resolve the matter.

It also helps here if you can reference the parts of the original contract. That have been broken.

 

The time for emails and phone calls has long since passed and this is now an official matter. All passed communications regarding the matter should be documented in the letter also, especially the hanging up of the phone as this counts as a direct avoidance of the terms of the contract.

 

Once everything is down on paper, give him 14 days to pay the amount + the appropriate fees (as Renaissance Design pointed out above) if (once?) he fails to pay, head down to the Citizens Advice Beauro where they will supply you with the correct forms to start a small claims court claim. With all the evidence you have collected and all the measures you've gone through to try and correct the situation in an amicable way, you shouldn't have any issues getting your money plus fees back.

 

Good luck

 

P.S. I'm not a trained solicitor, just a poor guy that's had to do this on a few occasions.

I'm with Rallport; appalling advice to give to someone. Being a push over is the reason why people like OP's client exist. You would never turn up to Topman and chuck a tenner on the counter for a 200 quid suit just because you don't want to pay anymore.

 

Never just take it on the chin. Why is it not worth pursuing? Sure, it's a pain in the ass and, depending on how much you value your time, it might cut your profits short but you still have to take action.

 

There are a lot of people out there that try and take the mickey out of people by doing this. They're ****ty clients and you'll start to learn to see these type a mile off. Good luck OP, but don't just back down

What I'd would be, go in there and change the password/uninstall the the theme you created. Make sure not to touch anything else he may have created, this means custom menus that where not a part of your original design etc.

The idea is not to cause any damage or distress to the client as this can be used to counter any legal action. Once you've done this, put it in the handwritten letter you send to the client via special delivery, making not of the date ad time at which you carried out the action, state (again) the reason why and state (again) the actions needed to resolve the matter.

It also helps here if you can reference the parts of the original contract. That have been broken.

 

Hi Mike, thanks for this. I'm on it. I changed the password before christmas, looks like they've copped on today with his assistant emailing if I had.

 

 

 

Why does the letter have to be handwritten? My handwriting is pretty bad.

 

Here is a draft of the letter I intend to send with sensitive data Xed out. Is the bold a bit much?

 

 

Dear XXXX XXXXXXX,

On the XX/XX/2012, I changed the password for the top admin level access to the site. I have left the site intact and it continues to function as originally intended. I have taken this action because you are several months late on paying invoice ref XXXX.

The original invoice was sent to you by post on XX/XX/2012 via Quick File Limited. I sent you a reminder by email after the invoice had passed it's due date on XX/XX/2012. You acknowledged the invoice by email on XX/XX/2012 and on XX/XX/2012, asking confirmation of payment details and stating your intention to send a cheque immediately. I confirmed payment details by email on XX/XX/2012.

Having not received a cheque, I emailed you on the XX/XX/2012. Almost 2 weeks later, I called you by phone on XX/XX/2012 at 8:30am, you hung up on me without answering my inquiry regarding due payment.

It is for this reason that I have restrained your access to the top level admin of the site. I am now charging 8.5% interest from the date the invoice was due, as well as £40 towards recovery costs (as per the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act. This brings the current total to £394.24. You now have 14 days to make good on your debt before I pursue legal action.

Regards…

Sorry, by 'handwritten' i meant an actual letter that you send recorded delivery via the Royal Mail. As you've correctly assumed, this would be fine to be typed so long as it was printed off and signed.

 

The letter above is perfect, i'd re-word the end section as it currently looks like you've not thought about legal advise. What you want to get across is this is the final demand before legal action is taken so try...

 

"This brings the current total to £394.24. As from the date of this notice, you have 14 days to make payment on your arrears. Please note that failure to comply will result in legal action".

 

As for the amount, nope, looks fine to me.

awesome. thanks again Mike!

 

As it so happened his assistant called me up earlier today to ask if i had changed the password. i told her yes and that i was planning legal action and didn't want to discuss anything further.

 

this is followed by me getting several calls from her boss. i ignore the calls.

 

5 minutes ago there is a knock at my door....

 

he's there, apologising, with a cheque in hand.

 

wtf?

 

anyway all sorted. amazing help from you guys i really really appreciate it. looks like a happy new year.

 

once again thanks to everyone who participated in this thread. now i know a lot more than i did before.

Edited January 3, 201313 yr by OWMC

Happens more often than actually going to court once they realise you're not messing around.

 

Well done mate, i'm glad for you.

You know, if you take him to smalls claims court, you can also make him pay your court fees. If you remind him of this, he should be even keener to pay you straight away!

 

Although it seemed to work without. well done!

Edited January 3, 201313 yr by Neil@creative

I have been very fortunate with my clients. The few times I've been ripped off I have just ignored it and moved on. I mean, you have to ask how much is your time worth and is this worth your time? If it is then court it is.

 

If not, then move on. That's all I would say to designers in similar situations.

 

Having said that, it helps to be friends with a good lawyer who can take care of you if you ever need it.

 

i haven't had to use a lawyer yet but...

 

I have a good one if I need one.

You know, if you take him to smalls claims court, you can also make him pay your court fees. If you remind him of this, he should be even keener to pay you straight away!

 

Although it seemed to work without. well done!

 

Nice to keep in mind. :-)

I have been very fortunate with my clients. The few times I've been ripped off I have just ignored it and moved on. I mean, you have to ask how much is your time worth and is this worth your time? If it is then court it is.

 

If not, then move on. That's all I would say to designers in similar situations.

 

Having said that, it helps to be friends with a good lawyer who can take care of you if you ever need it.

 

i haven't had to use a lawyer yet but...

 

I have a good one if I need one.

 

Its not the amount of money, its the principle of the thing. If the client refuses to pay you the money for a product they approved (god bless contracts and sign offs )then essentially they are stealing. Screw 'em, its your money, you earned it, what right do they have to keep it from you? If they try it a couple of times to different vendors, and each of them uses/threatens legal action, they may be more inclined to keep their end of the bargain in future - thus making the world a little bit better for everyone!

... thus making the world a little bit better for everyone!

 

You sold me on the idea. Haha. Thank you. I mostly just get so ticked off when somebody attempts to screw me over that I waste hours thinking of ways I can make their lives a living hell.

 

But then I just SCREEEEEAAAAAM! And I'm good.

 

I've been on both sides of the transaction.

 

Only a few months back I was working with a client on a new website and the "designer" sold us a $5 template which he didn't even have the HTML skills to edit for $750 dollars.

 

I wish I was kidding.

 

I personally would have taken legal action on it.

 

But I couldn't because it was my clients money and not my own.

 

I tell you, wanted to kill that "designer".

 

The thing is, I was a little vindictive and he still had unfinished "work" to do to live up to his end of the written agreement so I made him work his butt off for an extra week because he refused to issue a refund.

 

You can call me cruel.

 

It was cruel, but man, I had to build the whole website myself from scratch and...

 

I didn't even get paid!

 

I was soooo ticked off you wouldn't believe it.

 

The designer promised 10 "pages" and I made sure we got them.

 

Then I deleted every last one of them.

 

With a smile on my face.

 

It felt good.

Edited January 5, 201313 yr by WebsiteWriter

Sometimes its worth to bite the bullet with clients like this , we can automatically spot a time waster and difficult client from the minute we hang up the phone. If your relationship with the client isn't compatible don't take the work on. Difficult to turn away business but just remember a few things when a dealing with a new client.

 

- On your first email proposal with costs or whatever you need to ensure you have a expiration date on the proposal , make it 7 days which is plenty of time for them to respond. If they don't respond or call then forget about them as obviously the development isn't important to them.

 

- Get an idea of the content they already have and what format it is in before you accept to do the work , we once had 50 polaroid photos posted to us when we asked for some photos of the companies work and to make it worse all the text content was hand written with bad writing.

 

- Research the client , if they already have a site with another company do a credit check on them and you might find that company hasn't been paying its bills or is in liquidation but still needs a website.

 

One client we had traded under a false business name and was actually money laundering through his site , all of his cheques bounced and even the address was fake. !