Hello,

I am a website designer and normally design websites for artists like singers. In one of my projects, I finished designing the website and the owners of the website want to update the it by their own and actually the do not need me. I am a bit worry if they remove my logo under the website. I spent hours and hours to design it, now if someone edits the website, he could easily remove my logo and the design sign from the website and it will be a famous site, so many people likes to see their own name there.

 

Is there any way to register my work, or do something that prevent others to remove my logo from the site?

 

Basically what does professional designers do? How do they protect their work?

That's a copyright issue which should be dealt with in your contract.

Erm, I think you have it all wrong.

 

If they are paying you for a service, ie to 'design a website', then once that has been done and you have been paid then the website (and associated files) belong to them, not you.

 

You should already have it in writing (presumably you DO have a contract with this client?) that they are happy for your credit to remain on the site, if they are not happy, then simply remove it.

 

Also, I don't mean to sound rude, but have you taken any steps to make sure that this website is updateable by the client? You say you have finished it and now the client wants to update it by themselves? Was this not discussed, written in the brief/contract that they would require this kind of functionality?

 

Seems to me like there has been lack of communication over this project.

That's a copyright issue which should be dealt with in your contract.

 

Beat me!

 

Edit: That wasn't a request by the way...

Edited January 18, 201313 yr by roothost

If they are paying you for a service, ie to 'design a website', then once that has been done and you have been paid then the website (and associated files) belong to them, not you.

 

Depends. It's usually a good idea to licence a design exclusively to the client while retaining IP.

As a designer or any other type of creative person that creates, your work is automatically copyrighted.

 

If they are paying you for a service, ie to 'design a website', then once that has been done and you have been paid then the website (and associated files) belong to them, not you.

 

roothost, this is far from right. YOU have complete rights over your work and its complete ownership, unless you give an exclusive rights as Renaissance mentioned. By default they can't and should not itterate your work or give it to anyone else to do that. If you give an exclusive ownership this should be clearly outlined in the contract. Most designers charge a lot (3-4 or more times the regular quote) to give away exclusive ownership.

Edited January 19, 201313 yr by Kalo

Well I have a contract but in the contract I did not state about the logo and ownership clearly. But before we start the project they said that they need me to update the website so like many other websites that I manage, no one can access them except me so I know the logo will not be removed. This particular project made me worry because they mentioned that they will update website.

 

I was thinking if there is a compiler or something that required me to manage the files. Or even a piece of code that if the copyright sentence changes, then it mess the index file or something like that. These ideas are all I was thinking and am not sure how much they can be realistic. But as a designer we should have a tool to protect our products.

If they are paying you for a service, ie to 'design a website', then once that has been done and you have been paid then the website (and associated files) belong to them, not you.

 

Thank you for your reply. But I dont agree with the top sentence because it is true that we get paid for designing something, but still the client is not allowed to remove the designer's name and write his/her name instead. Of course they can even remove the work and but cannot pretend that they design it by their self.

 

That's the way I'm thinking about it, but it might be wrong, as of course I am not that experienced.

If you are building websites for people who want to update them them selves, you should really be thinking of a CMS solution (wordpress is great for this) if they are not that happy with dealing with code. Your work is protected by copywrite laws and as other people have said, if the client wants exclusivity, they have to pay for it. Make sure things like that are written into your contract.

One thing you said worries me. You said that :

But before we start the project they said that they need me to update the website so like many other websites that I manage, no one can access them except me so I know the logo will not be removed.

Does this mean you don't give the clients access to their own site? This can be a minefield! Unless the client specifically asks me to look after the site after its gone live, they have to pay for this. If not, after you and the client have fulfilled every thing specified in the brief/quote/contract, then its not your problem anymore.

If they then use your logo or site elsewhere, with your permission or without paying for it (or anything not in the contract), send a email to them asking them to take down that site or stop using the logo. If that doesn't happen after that, then I'm afraid its time to lawyer up.

 

I was thinking if there is a compiler or something that required me to manage the files. Or even a piece of code that if the copyright sentence changes, then it mess the index file or something like that. These ideas are all I was thinking and am not sure how much they can be realistic. But as a designer we should have a tool to protect our products.

 

There is a tool - it's called communication. It's very strange that you've acomplished a complete project for them and now you are scared that they might remove your credits without notifying you and asking your permission. It sounds like they're not a client of yours but some kind of competition or fraud people you've been dealing with. Such kind of basic understandings should be covered without any contracts.

There is a tool - it's called communication. It's very strange that you've acomplished a complete project for them and now you are scared that they might remove your credits without notifying you and asking your permission. It sounds like they're not a client of yours but some kind of competition or fraud people you've been dealing with. Such kind of basic understandings should be covered without any contracts.

I agree, chat about these things first so its clear in the clients mind, but always nail it down tight in a contract . Been burned by this in the past.

These links might help you out in understanding copyright of work:

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-ownership/c-ownership-faq/c-ownership-faq-who.htm

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-ownership/c-commissioned.htm

 

Personally though I agree with roothost, as soon as the client has paid their bill the website is theirs to do with as they want. I've just never seen the point in making someone's life difficult when they're the ones who hired me to do a job in the first place. After all it's their company, it's their brand, it's their online representation of themselves, so if they want to hire another design company to do some work on the site, or feel they can do it themselves then who am I to stand in their way?

 

Luckily the company I work for has the same philosophy as me. Although their standard practice is to remove the designed by credit on the site before allowing them or another company to edit the design or code in anyway...after all if they make a mess of it we don't want it to be associated with us

 

Come to think of it all the design companies I have worked for have that philosophy and I can only think of one instant when dealing with another design studios over a websites management. But that was more to do with it being built on their own custom CMS platform rather then the sites design, that they didn't mind what we did with, they just didn't want us adapting their CMS.

There is a tool - it's called communication. It's very strange that you've acomplished a complete project for them and now you are scared that they might remove your credits without notifying you and asking your permission. It sounds like they're not a client of yours but some kind of competition or fraud people you've been dealing with. Such kind of basic understandings should be covered without any contracts.

 

I do agree with you, but as I said people might not be the same as before. Of course before the website goes live, they promise and everything is like they are happy with you, but once the website is live and up. They can easily ignore what they supposed to do and just say OK now we want to remove your logo. As simple as that.

 

I do not care to update website after it is up. all I care is that do not want the client remove the logo from the template. However I am still not sure if that's my right or not. Otherwise I would thinking to create a tool to mess up the index file once logo is touched.

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on legality but I agree that you need to establish some sort of consensus through a signed contract as well as through communicating with your client. Unfortunately as best as intentions and promises go, it comes down to business and if you don't have anything in writing, you aren't always protected. Again, not an expert so don't take my opinion as fact, but I have seen others being 'burnt' in the past in similar situations.

 

I understand your frustration when you put a lot of time and effort into a design only for the client to make adjustments, but in fairness, they are paying for a service and once the project is complete, they are entitled to modify where they see fit (unless you have agreed within the contract beforehand). Implementing a tool to mess up their site does not seem like a good avenue to go down, in my opinion. Could you not speak to your clients to get a better understanding of their intentions? It might be a bit fruitless now, but it might help you for future projects.

Seriously, why do you care? Keep a copy of the logo in your portfolio and don't put a link back to your site on their site. Unless you have something specified in writing in your contract, they paid for it, its theirs.

As for writing a script that messes up the index page if they touch the logo? Think of it in these terms. You go buy a brand new car. A month later you decide you don't like the nice wheels the dealership gave you and put on some blimming horrible rims that mess up the nice clean lines of the car. The car detects this change and decides to blow up its own engine. You'd be upset right? I mean, you paid for the car you can do what you want to do to it right? Get my drift?

Personally though I agree with roothost, as soon as the client has paid their bill the website is theirs to do with as they want. I've just never seen the point in making someone's life difficult when they're the ones who hired me to do a job in the first place. After all it's their company, it's their brand, it's their online representation of themselves, so if they want to hire another design company to do some work on the site, or feel they can do it themselves then who am I to stand in their way?

 

Dizi, this makes sense. But technically speaking is just the contrary to what the copyrig rule states in the IPO guidelines which you linked just two lines above.

 

" After all it's their company, it's their brand, it's their online representation of themselves, so if they want to hire another design company to do some work on the site, or feel they can do it themselves then who am I to stand in their way?"

 

It's their company but your design. You are the owner of your design work. So I'll write it again - they can't do anything without your permission, they can't edit it themselve, neither they can hire a company to work on your design unless they have your own explicit permission.

 

And this is what IPO says just taken straight away from the page you linked. In case you don't trust my words, as obviously some people are skiming trhoug them (unfortunately):

 

When you ask or commission another person or organisation to create a copyright work for you, the first legal owner of copyright is the person or organisation that created the work and not you the commissioner, unless you otherwise agree it in writing.

 

In your case djdany, since you have created your work with your logo included, they don't really have the rights to iterate your work and remove your logo, unless they have your permission. However if they do that, just simply explain to them these plain copyright standards and I'm sure if they are normal people, they'll put your logo back. If they don't, you are working with people who don't really care about copyright ownership and might as well take them to court if you can prove you are the original creator of the work. Which of course I'm not suggesting, as would be very retarded to take someone to court for a footer logo..but that's theoritically how things work.

Edited January 19, 201313 yr by Kalo

I never said anywhere that those links backed up my opinion, I only posted the copyright them to show what a designers rights are as the OP wanted to know where they stood legally.

 

As I stated, personally I believe that once the site is paid for the person who contracted me to do it can do with that design what they like and just because I can legally hold the copyright of all the designs I create, it doesn't mean that I have to do this.

I think there is a little confusion between what the general understanding of copyright is and what the OP's actual issue is.

 

As already stated an artist/ designer retains copyright unless sold within the contract, now that means my client cannot sell on the website design say by making copies of it, be that code or graphics. But the website is theirs and it would have to be a pretty tight contract and a rather stupid client to end up in a situation where a client cannot update or make changes to the content.Unless you did the copy-writing then they'd likely own it anyway.

 

I'd also expect that if I told a client they had to have my logo on their website I'd lose a lot of business from bigger clients, I think its quite cheeky to think it should. Normally designers come up with an extra deal to get the logo put on the site.

 

Makes no difference how big the business/ artist/ website gets your paid to make a website at the end of the day.