I'm starting to now drag myself away from table based layouts. What are people's thoughts on Dreamweaver as I'm no fan of coding and I'm more interested in the aesthetics of website building. I've been using MX till now and wondered if it's worth upgrading or buying a different program.

Thanks for any responses.

If you aren't a coder, just don't code at all.

 

I'm no plumber, so I don't fiddle about with the boiler at home.

 

If you love design, be a designer. Build sites as PSD files and give them to professionals to code for you.

 

Don't let dreamweaver 'code' sites for you - it is a quickfire way to looking like a bedroom photoshopper who is just a bit of a joke really.

 

Stick to what you are good at is my advice

Thanks for your response terydinho.

 

Firstly though,I'm not saying I'm not a coder. I know how to code but just think it's dull and want to limit it as much as possible. I was a graphic designer for the last company I worked for but was made redundant and although I've built a few sites I'm not going to ask others to do the coding when I can do it myself. Even more so now my redundancy money is dwindling at a far greater rate than I would wish.

 

'Don't let dreamweaver 'code' sites for you - it is a quickfire way to looking like a bedroom photoshopper who is just a bit of a joke really.'

 

Hmmm.. I wonder if others agree with this?

 

Hmmm.. I wonder if others agree with this?

 

Fraid so, if you let dreamweaver generate the code for you you are going to struggle to find your way around the code, also design view is next to useless as what you see in dreamweaver is almost certainly not what you are going to get in your browser.

Fraid so, if you let dreamweaver generate the code for you you are going to struggle to find your way around the code, also design view is next to useless as what you see in dreamweaver is almost certainly not what you are going to get in your browser.

 

I have been using MX till now and never struggled with the coding too much. I generally can find out if something is amiss.

 

Maybe I should ask does anyone use Dreamweaver?

I use dreamweaver cs3 at the moment. I love it. It is great.

 

If you use the code view only, then it has loads of cool features, auto complete, syntax highlighting etc... it is wicked in my opinion

Ok thanks for your responses. Looks like I'll have to raid the piggy bank lol

I used Dreamweaver in secondry school. Haven't touched it since. I find it more helpful, and much better learning wise, to code it in a basic text editor. I personally use PSPad.

 

I'm sure it's a great tool, but I'm perfectly happy with my text editor. .

 

FYI - If you let a program do the hard work.. where does it help you learn / retain your skills ?

This is an interesting debate and something I raised on here a few days ago.

 

It seems that there's a view that DW almost stops you from learning coding, as it finishes codes for you. Whereas with other tools you have to learn coding which means you get to know coding inside out.

 

As one poster points out, maybe you can have the best of both worlds with DW, by learning from it.

 

I too can't see the point of coding all day if you're more interested in design (like me), although I would want to do both design and coding as I would want full flexibility and control of everything the site contains.

 

But if DW can take away some of the time coding takes, surely this can be good as long as you also learn and have knowledge of coding so you can still have the flexibility of coding yourself?

 

Can DW be likened to shop bought pastry? You could make it yourself (like coding), but why bother.....

Dream weaver is good for a text editor, as mentioned the auto-completing code and the ability to preview a local page is the brilliant side of dreamweaver, but as echoed autocode generation features can save a little time but can also cause extra work.

If you've got a mac, and willing to spend about 100$, get Coda. It's simply amazing.

I suppose you could learn from it. I guess I've just done things differently, and have much more of a desire to code than to design.. so I suppose that's where it differs.

 

I don't know many, if any, web developers who use dreamweaver. It has its advantages, agreed. I've just never felt a need for it personally.

 

But if it makes things easier / quicker.. then fair enough. I'd rather do it the long way. .

I use dreamweaver cs3 at the moment. I love it. It is great.

 

If you use the code view only, then it has loads of cool features, auto complete, syntax highlighting etc... it is wicked in my opinion

 

Ditto.

 

I use DW CS4 and I'm loving this really great tool for hand coding.

as you could also undoubtedly call it current industry standard like Photoshop is in graphic design.

 

but could you? is that factually correct?

but could you? is that factually correct?

 

I'd say that if you want to work in an agency, then yes, it is factually correct. Most agencies ask for you to work in Dreamweaver, just because they buy the cs3/4/5 package and want to make the most of it

If you aren't a coder, just don't code at all.

 

Well Said +1

Does this essentially boil down to a designer/coder preference?

Dreamweaver is an overpriced pile of heaving buttchuck. Fact.

There are simply too many free text editors and IDE's that do it's job without costing you a penny, and in fact do the job better. Is it an industry standard - maybe in terms of the amount of people using it. In terms of what it can do, no. In that regard it's pants moustache.

Well Said +1

 

 

Without wanting to keep repeating myself, I did say in the original post that I'm not a fan of coding. That doesn't mean I'm not a coder.

Does this essentially boil down to a designer/coder preference?

 

No, not really. It's more a case of taking away some of what I see is tedious coding. Obviously we all need to have knowledge of coding to know where to correct the coding if a program messes up. Bearing that in mind I would say it boils down to designer/coding in equal measure.

By the way, thanks all

I've been using Dreamweaver lately just for the experience and so I can tell future employers and the like yeah I’ve used it. I use it in split mode but only edit the code and use the design half to see the changes. Auto completing tags is helpful and it takes away some of that tedium. Now I’m use to it I’ll continue using it.

 

I’m not sure it’s worth the price tag though; I had it sitting on my computer collecting dust because I have Adobe Mater Collection.

I didn't notice point 4 was missing but I did notice your grammar was wrong in point 5.

?

I didn't notice point 4 was missing but I did notice your grammar was wrong in point 5.

I think that was a response to terydinho's signature..?

 

1) You are on the internet

2) You are visiting WDF

3) You are reading my signature

5) You didn't noticed that point 4 is missing

6) You just checked for point 4

7) You are smiling

I see

 

 

grammar was wrong in point 5.

 

 

Was wrong or is wrong?

I studied as a graphic designer and also worked as one for a while, which in a way is a problem when it comes to transferring those skills into web design. This is because we come into it purely with an aesthetic mindset, but the problem is in web design how the site looks is just a bonus rather than a top priority.

 

The point of a website is to reach as many people as possible and some of these people might be using screen readers or have images switched off or using something other than a modern day browsers to view the site. So while a graphic designer thinks looks are important, to a the end user how functional and usable it is are much more important. Which means that the code needs to be the best it can be, so while you might not like doing it if you want to create websites from start to finish it is a must to do the code...sorry.

 

Although there is nothing wrong with using Dreamweaver and many members on this forum do use it, just let it aid you with hand coding with its code hints feature while you type and its ability to close tags in the correct order, it makes it quicker and easier. The only issue comes when you let any WYSIWYG editor create the code for you as it will bloat it (especially if you use a drag and drop one).

 

 

The other option is as terydinho said, if you really can't stand it the join forces with someone who likes coding but doesn't really like the design side, that way you both get to do what you like.

Although there is nothing wrong with using Dreamweaver and many members on this forum do use it, just let it aid you with hand coding with its code hints feature while you type and its ability to close tags in the correct order, it makes it quicker and easier. The only issue comes when you let any WYSIWYG editor create the code for you as it will bloat it (especially if you use a drag and drop one).

 

 

The other option is as terydinho said, if you really can't stand it the join forces with someone who likes coding but doesn't really like the design side, that way you both get to do what you like.

 

Fully agree with this.

 

 

Kyle

Posted Today, 02:06 PM

 

Dizi, on 31 July 2010 - 08:17 AM, said:

 

Although there is nothing wrong with using Dreamweaver and many members on this forum do use it, just let it aid you with hand coding with its code hints feature while you type and its ability to close tags in the correct order, it makes it quicker and easier. The only issue comes when you let any WYSIWYG editor create the code for you as it will bloat it (especially if you use a drag and drop one).

 

 

The other option is as terydinho said, if you really can't stand it the join forces with someone who likes coding but doesn't really like the design side, that way you both get to do what you like.

 

 

Fully agree with this.

 

 

Kyle

 

 

Ditto.

+1 to Dizi

I would say it is worth sticking with dreamweaver, i code in dreamweaver as it has useful tools to speed things up and if you have alot of work and alot of websites its easy to switch between sites. As long as you are coding yourself and not letting dreamweaver do most of the work then you will be fine!

 

Download some free templates and pull them apart and see how they are built, this also helped me back in the day.

 

Everything i know from web design, development and seo i have learnt myself with online tutorials.

 

Regards

http://www.design-vibe.co.uk

What are these "extra bits" that Dreamweaver apparently adds?

 

I use dreamweaver in split mode, but can't understand why its so apparently bad...

 

(I'm off to read the code of you "hand coders") Just sounds a bit elitist to me...

 

 

SP*

Edited August 2, 201016 yr by cavking

What are these "extra bits" that Dreamweaver apparently adds?

 

I use dreamweaver in split mode, but can't understand why its so apparently bad...

 

(I'm off to read the code of you "hand coders") Just sounds a bit elitest ot me...

Not elitist*, just professional. Allowing an application to generate generic code for you is never a good approach.

The majority of Dreamweaver users here are happy using it as a code editor, which is great.

Not elitist*, just professional. Allowing an application to generate generic code for you is never a good approach.

The majority of Dreamweaver users here are happy using it as a code editor, which is great.

 

I'm guessing you would never ever use predictive text on your mobile phone then?

I'm guessing you would never ever use predictive text on your mobile phone then?

Irrelevant as it is, I've never used it no - but I've used iPhone models for 2 years now so it's very different.

Predictive text is similar to syntax highlighting and auto-closing of tags (or in context, words). It's not generating whole sentences/texts for you.

 

Edit: I should mention that I may be out of touch with Nokia/Sony Ericsson text technology now.

Irrelevant as it is, I've never used it no - but I've used iPhone models for 2 years now so it's very different.

Predictive text is similar to syntax highlighting and auto-closing of tags (or in context, words). It's not generating whole sentences/texts for you.

 

Edit: I should mention that I may be out of touch with Nokia/Sony Ericsson text technology now.

 

So providing you are looking at code view and checking it, dreamweaver can be used?

So providing you are looking at code view and checking it, dreamweaver can be used?

Of course! You're just using it as a code editor. The issue is with people who click 'insert table' for example. That's when things start to go wrong with the code.

 

If you're using it as a simple code editor, there are more efficient ones available for a price tag of £0. That's the reason I stay away from DW at all costs. It's useless at doing what you pay for, and the rest can be done (more efficiently and elegantly) for free.

 

Having said that, I use Coda which isn't free but, as a code editor, is unbeatable.

Of course! You're just using it as a code editor. The issue is with people who click 'insert table' for example. That's when things start to go wrong with the code.

 

If you're using it as a simple code editor, there are more efficient ones available for a price tag of £0. That's the reason I stay away from DW at all costs. It's useless at doing what you pay for, and the rest can be done (more efficiently and elegantly) for free.

 

Having said that, I use Coda which isn't free but, as a code editor, is unbeatable.

Ok, I understand your point. I just don't think developers telling people "don't touch dreamweaver it's the devil" is the right advice. Probably more like "There's better options for cheaper".

 

I haven't tried anything other then dreamweaver (apart from frontpage a thousand years ago) so I'm not in a position say dreamweaver is the best - but it get's the job done for me (I use split mode)as far as valid code goes. Although I agree that there are bits of code that do need to be hand written.

Design view isn't far off 'the devil'

I do accept that, as a code editor, it does what all the others do.

Design view isn't far off 'the devil'

I do accept that, as a code editor, it does what all the others do.

 

Yes, design does not equal live view for any of the browsers - that is one down side.

I use dreamweaver on a daily basis but only as a code editor, I wouldn't like to let it generate the code for me no matter how clever a program it may be, after all its almost always easier to edit code you wrote in the first place.

It doesn't usually take long to transfer a PSD design to code any way.