If you can't take criticism, then you're in the wrong job.

 

 

yup yup, if you put something visual out there you will always have people who hate it and others who really love it, nothing is perfect and with that you have to have a thick skin when it comes to designing sites, as someone will always have something bad to say

unfortunately when the MD is a designer then runs design and development as two legally seperate companies guess which one gets screwed by the other little darlings that can do no wrong :-\ Doesn't stop us moaning at them all the time though

unfortunately when the MD is a designer then runs design and development as two legally seperate companies guess which one gets screwed by the other little darlings that can do no wrong :-\ Doesn't stop us moaning at them all the time though

 

You try getting people to think about what they write on sites - "Nah, we'll stuff the copy in afterwards!"

the designers do use lorum ipsum. But they design sites like printed material so forget that font sizes grow larger for hard of sight people or that clients don't write in exactly the amount of words they designed for :-) But no trying to get clients to write something decent is annoying and it only get's worse on the internationals because you have translations to match up

Wow that site really needs an overhaul............. I've already offered them full SEO services for free, but haven't heard much back other than that someone is building a database?

 

Think this needs a bit more organisation?

I'd happily make the design for them but like I said earlier, I can't devote time to entering a competition so I'd need to know it would be put to use – not a "possible layout". I don't want to step on anyone's toes or to patronise Christopher either

 

The UKYIA is a great concept and I think it deserves the best, it should show off what us "young designers" can really do.

I totally agree with your views - and do feel that there are lots of valid points made. I'm only one person, yes, i may have started it, but the idea is that we work together to create something useful and worthwhile.

 

So we really do need to formulate a plan - because to be totally honest there isn't really one at the moment except the concept, and there's plenty that does need doing. Its a young idea - one that could work but needs work, as such.

 

 

 

I do apprieciate your offer EggMan, i haven't forgotten it but i think we need to formulate a plan of campaign:

 

- Website

- SEO

- Database

- Content

 

I also like the Oldies idea, it needs to be thought through and see what can work!

 

(Oh, and Rob, please don't go!)

 

We need a comprehensive list of what needs doing and assign people to it - from experience i know one person can't do everything. I think now we have a decent membership number they are the priorities.

 

Christopher

I'm not happy to submit something to a competition but you can put me down for the website design if you need anyone

I do agree with you in some respect that i don't think the competition is necessarily a good way of doing it, but a rough idea of your plans before the go-ahead would probably be worthwhile!

 

I also think that we need to sort out an order of priorities - i've never worked on something this large before, and hopefully if we pull people together we'll make something of it.

 

I know i'm not perfect - nobody is - but many people have skills i don't.

1Christopher,

 

I think you need to go away and put together a full list of requirements for the project for everything from the backend database, the design, the campaign to get members, the "oldies" idea, targets of SEO, content we need.

 

The whole shebang.

 

Once you know what needs doing you can put together a team to fulfill your requirements.

 

I have said I can help with a backend system from 17th May onwards if you want me?

The system may need a secondary programmer though, depends how big your requirements list turns out to be.

 

Without taking this away from anyone else, a potential idea would be to have a team with Rob, Eggman, Wizely, myself and a few others, each with set tasks. I'd love to have a hand in the design as well as development, so I could be Rob's no. two on that front if he wanted, else just act as adviser as I do anyway

Wizely's skills are something which we could really use to our advantage, Eggman is definately the person for SEO.

 

The skills are there and available to you, all you need to do is organise them.

Organising is something I'm good at, so if you need a hand on that front, I'd also be glad to help, from May 17th.

 

For now, I think you really need to focus on synthesis and realisation of all the ideas that are flying around and consolidate them into a set of specifications and requirements.

You should have competitions for various things. It'd look good on a CV. And maybe a service to let people from the same area get in touch to build a project - at the moment i can't see any way to even browse or search for users.

You should have competitions for various things. It'd look good on a CV. And maybe a service to let people from the same area get in touch to build a project - at the moment i can't see any way to even browse or search for users.

 

 

I think its a great concept, unfortunately it has lost direction and just seems like a place to sign up to rather than something of any use. So really the website needs a lot of direction to change it from just being a database of names, into actually being something that could be seen as a useful resource for those that are young and just starting out.

 

So I think you need to go back and think what do we actually want this site to do, and what does it need on it to accomplish this.

Dizi, i think you've hit the nail on the head. Part of the main idea is recognition, and something to show you care, but there really should be more to it than that. We're now beginning to work on it.

 

 

Pea, the main problem with browsing was there is no database. That's something that will be sorted soon i hope. The things you've mentioned are things we are thinking about, but everyone has to remember it's early days.

 

As for lost direction, not sure we ever had any No, probably thats an exaggeration!

www.oldfartsontheweb.org anyone? *

 

 

It does seem like a good idea, just need to get some people in roles that suit them. Delegation is the key.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

* How many people clicked that link?

www.oldfartsontheweb.org anyone? *

 

Define old !!!

 

This thread and idea makes me feel ancient lol. I'm seriously considering making an "NotSoYoungInternetAlliance*

 

Seriously tho, the idea behind this is a valid one, and if pushed in the right direction, could definitely benefit all you "Young 'uns" (Now I definitely feel old )

Define old !!!

 

 

Well going by the description of young 26 and over is old...woohoo I'm still young for another year

 

 

 

I look forward to seeing what happens with the young ones though as the site could be great if something is made of the idea

I thought this project had gone out of the window.. i am a member and i offered my help with the database etc but never heard anything back...

 

if you are going to run something like this it really needs to organized

AVV, Everyone who is involved has other commitments. Its very difficult to try and get something like this going, and i'm in the middle of exams, etc, and so its difficult. We think we're sorted for people to help for the moment, but it could become confusing if 'too many cooks', you get the idea.

 

Oh, and i wouldn't throw anything out the window yet - it's early days and i'm not one to give up.

 

Christopher

I really hope that 1chris does go away and come back with a carefully scrupulated plan; it seems a lot of professionals here are offering their hand in the mucking.

 

I for one would be happy to do / help out with the website's design, if you need me?

 

Rob's offered up his help I believe, we may be able to work at it together.

AVV, Everyone who is involved has other commitments. Its very difficult to try and get something like this going, and i'm in the middle of exams, etc, and so its difficult. We think we're sorted for people to help for the moment, but it could become confusing if 'too many cooks', you get the idea.

 

Oh, and i wouldn't throw anything out the window yet - it's early days and i'm not one to give up.

 

Christopher

 

 

I think if that is the case you shouldn't have started this up until you had a bit of time to carefully plan and organise how everything will work and who will do what. It is hard to balance and juggle everything as I am sure you are learning, with everyone here throwing you ideas and you having all the other commitments.

 

Its a shame really as with you not really having the time to give this some proper commitment and it now being out there and featured in magazines, people could see the website and its members as disorganised and not want to give any of the members a chance. Something like this does reflect on all of its members so I would strongly urge that you take a little time (after your exams) to fully re-evaluate the site, what it needs, who is best to do it, how it will be achieve in the quickest and most effective manner.

 

Unfortunately being a project manger of something like this will be hard and will take up a lot of time. No offence with this next comment, but I think that it will be more difficult for someone like you who probably doesn't have that much experience in managing things to manage what seems to me like a huge project. I don't mean to say that you won't be able to, I just think with lack of experience pulling it all together, being organised, and not loosing your direction with this could be difficult and challenging....and very much worth it once it is done

 

 

Organisation is needed, a big discussion on what the site need to succeed is also needed, plus a few of its members need to be brought in to help with the site as soon as you have time to do that...Really what you need is a business plan drafted up so that you will achieve everything that you need to (and know what these are).

 

 

Finally I think wizely will be proud of what I have to say as my final word as you should always leave the most important thing till last You should look at the content of the site first, rather than getting a designer to design a site first. You really need to organise what is going to be on the site before you work on a design, as it is a waste of design talent if there is no clear plan of what is needed.

 

 

Again Good Luck

I'd really like to follow this project if you're committed to it. I know how annoying it is with half the internet asking for features, but something like a blog would be great.

yeah i know everyone has their own things to do but really starting a project of this size but was a bit silly if you had no plans etc

I think i have to disagree with you there, AVV. As one person, i had a general idea of what i wanted, but with a project like this you really need people behind you and working together to give it direction. I think in this respect we've been successful in the fact we know have a body of people who are all behind the idea to act as a springboard, and discuss what direction it needs to go in.

Finally I think wizely will be proud of what I have to say as my final word as you should always leave the most important thing till last You should look at the content of the site first, rather than getting a designer to design a site first. You really need to organise what is going to be on the site before you work on a design, as it is a waste of design talent if there is no clear plan of what is needed.

 

Proud? I'll be drawing-up adoption papers soon!

 

As for the UKYIA and trying to get organised - I for one was a Business Analyst for many a year and I'm sure there are many more of us oldies out here with skills and experience that is simply not possible to get before the age of 26 considering just getting out of uni doesn't leave much of those years left.

 

I would advise you to, even before looking at content (oh yes, I did!) draw-up a serious 'business plan' - and take it as serious as you would a £1 million investment. Then circulate it out to members etc. for review. This review period should be short (1 week?) so that it doesn't suffer 'paralysis from analysis'.

 

Define clear aims at what you want the UKYIA and set targets that are tough but achievable. This will give you the direction needed to draw-up how you will achieve these targets and allow you to give feedback to your members so they get a sense that things are being achieved (like submitting quarterly reports to shareholders). You can then 'delegate' the work and manage the timing and integrating of the different aspects (no easy task - you could benefit from an experienced PM to help you here).

 

Without seeming rude here... but I'm just re-iterating the 'need for oldies' point... I could help you here - but what's in it for me? I can't join the association or be affiliated with it and it's purpose is to assist young people and offers nothing to me. You should consider how 'oldies' might play a role in the association and write that in you business plan - it might make sense to make that a priority.

 

Now, I'm not really that callous and you have an offer from me to help you with a plan (fitted around my other commitments) and then, with a clear direction, you can work with the experts in each field that are offering help to work on the next step of how to do things.

 

Planning, preparation and maintained direction are probably 90% of a successful project - the talent you have available to you shouldn't be wasted on rewrites and redesigns or worst, lost because they cannot see where the UKYIA is going.

 

Don't take any of our posts as negative - I think, even us oldies, want to see you succeed - I just detect the frustration of talent not being used.

I would advise you to, even before looking at content (oh yes, I did!) draw-up a serious 'business plan' - and take it as serious as you would a £1 million investment. Then circulate it out to members etc. for review. This review period should be short (1 week?) so that it doesn't suffer 'paralysis from analysis'.

 

 

 

 

structure before content...say that isn't what you are suggesting... can't be

structure before content...say that isn't what you are suggesting... can't be

 

Did I say structure mon cheri? Even I can't write effective content without a subject to write about and even you can't structure thin air!

 

Oh there's an article in Copy Corner coming on this you bet you there is! It's going to use novel-writing skills to explain structuring copy - I might even include snippets from my unfinished novel if you're good!

ok sure thing... i know sorry if i seemed rude as it was not my intention but a lot of (really good) designers have offered their time etc to help you with any site related work and have not heard anything back and now you are saying you need to "discuss" what to do next...

 

it just might seem annoying to some people...

Hey...

 

I see the UKYIA has another new design and i like it a lot.. but something about the font is putting me off.. it might be just a bit too dark

Hey...

 

I see the UKYIA has another new design and i like it a lot.. but something about the font is putting me off.. it might be just a bit too dark

 

 

 

No its been like that for a while now...or at least it has for me

really.. since when.. i only checked it the other day i am sure....

It's been like that for at least 2–3 days for me, it's what sparked off this whole discussion

It's been like that for at least 2–3 days for me, it's what sparked off this whole discussion

 

True. This design, as we've all been saying, is not good enough.

we've all established my design isnt good - there are plans, but things take time. we'll be sending out a mass message soon, so as i've said before, be patient and hopefully things will happen.

ha ha sorry... me being confused there

www.oldfartsontheweb.org anyone? *

It does seem like a good idea, just need to get some people in roles that suit them. Delegation is the key.

* How many people clicked that link?

 

 

Yes I'd join....

 

you are witnessing a live example of what would happen if you sent all the teachers home and left the children to run a school

I tried joining and they said it wasn't my website Maybe that's a compliment

Yes I'd join....

 

you are witnessing a live example of what would happen if you sent all the teachers home and left the children to run a school

 

brilliant way to put it. we need our school staff in the long-run !

Lets cut Chris some slack, he's aware of the issues by now and I know for a fact that he's on the case.

I agree with eggman, this is just going around in circles now, the issues and suggestions on how to deal with them have been given, there is no reason for attacks.

 

 

If you have constructive criticisms about the site or any other suggestions about what the site would benefit from then by all means suggest them, but lets leave the catty comments at home

I had a look at the other websites on there and they're id pages. Maybe that's what did wrong. The registration leads you to think they want an example of some work. Either that or they don't like me.