I'm after a bit of a second opinion after a recent chat with a Web Developer.

 

After making the decision to enter the world of software/web development, I went to speak to a chap I know today for some advice on a career change. His advice was basically "don't bother".

 

He said at 24, I've missed the boat and all web designers live and breathe web development from the age of 15 and will be miles ahead of me. Now, I'm not expecting to be able to compete with somebody with 10 years experience, but to be told there's no point in trying really surprised me.

 

He also told me that software engineers and web developers are '10 a penny'. Is this really the case? 80% of the jobs I see advertised are for developers/programmers so there has got to be SOME demand for them.

 

So, over to you...

 

Am I too 'old' to start training at 24?

 

Are web developers really '10 a penny'?

I'm 29 and started when 24...self taught too. Can design better sites than some young'uns.

 

Designers are 10 a penny, good/reliable ones with a strong creative streak with a USP however.....

 

Forget all this "too old to do X" crap that's so defeatist.

of course you're not to old ... it will take some time to learn things but learning is fun

Go and slap whoever told you that with a large wet fish.

 

If you've got motivation and are keen to learn you'll be fine.

You've got to remember that education basically stopped about 8 years ago - so nobody younger than you has actually learnt anything!!! Plus technology moves so fast, things learnt even 5 years ago are already out of date!

I'm the last person in the world to give the "you can do anything you put your mind to" speach - if you've got an aptitude and desire to do this you can. Don't believe the propaganda of the young!

A lot of 15 year olds have their heads up their own arses and think they are better than everyone else and most of the time very stubborn and arrogant and to be honest there are a few that should, because they are good, but others just are not. There is no age limit, as long as you put the effort in to learn everything I don't see a problem.

I created my first HTML page at 14 but only started getting back into website development over the past few months. Things have changed so much! Although it was easy to pick new things up like XHTML (im now 21) it's still different and something new to learn.

 

Everyone has a chance at web design/development, that's the beauty of it. How good you are depends on how determined you are. In the case of designing sites you have to just "have it" and be able to do it, much like you have good and bad artists.

 

So in my opinion the answer is no. Go for it and enjoy!

I would listen to any of that crap - your NEVER to old to learn a new skill. If you show a flair of creativity in your designs then you will go far

 

Maybe the developer told you that because he didn't want any competition?

Thanks guys!

 

I kinda new it wasn't too late for me, but it's always nice to hear it from people in the know.

 

Right - decision made then! Although I'm A+ and Network+ certified I think a different path is calling me.

 

Am I being realistic in being able to self-study at home? Are there any decent books, courses or websites (apart from this one! ) that I should look at as a 'study guide'?

 

Thanks again,

 

Nick.

You are never too old, not if you get a passion for something. Web designers and developers are 10 a penny yes, but a lot of these people think that web design is as easy as picking up a WYSIWYG editor and just dragging and dropping so about 8 of those pennies aren't really that great

 

 

Here is my advice for what it is worth:

 

You don't have to be a jack of all trades when it comes to web design and development. You can pick if you want to be a web designer or a developer, if you want to do both then it would be best in my opinion to start on the designer path learn the basics and then move on to the more advanced things such as php and the likes. Yes some start when they are 15 but that doesn't mean that they are all talented.

 

The most important thing that you need to have and to remember is that the web is always changing and ways of creating websites is always evolving. So you need to have passion for this and also a eagerness to learn, as you will always be a student, you will never know it all. To some this is exciting and to others it is scary, you might meet people who have been designing sites for 10 years but refuse to move forward with the web and stay stuck using techniques that they learnt 10 years go because they work for them.

 

 

Anyway enough ranting, you aren't too old! if you need a hand with where to start then you have this forum, we can help get you on the right path, if this is something that you wish to do

Am I being realistic in being able to self-study at home? Are there any decent books, courses or websites (apart from this one! ) that I should look at as a 'study guide'?

 

Thanks again,

 

Nick.

 

 

If you are motivated to teach yourself then it is the best way to go. Two great sites to start on would be:

 

http://htmldog.com/

http://www.w3schools.com/

 

 

HTML dog is the one I reccommend to anyone who is just starting out as their tutorials are amazing

 

Books wise you might like to look in our book review section as that has some great book reviews or this topic :

 

http://www.webdesignerforum.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=4812

Cheers Dizi,

 

Looks like I'll be sticking around for a bit!

Just to add, there won't be one designer/coder here that isn't constantly learning every time they put finger to key (or shortly after testing your design in IE).

 

Every time I design a site it gets cleaner faster and better. I could go back and rewrite older designs and I would laugh at how I done them.

There is a survey currently under way on alistapart for web designers and as part of the article they had results from last years survey, the majority of those in the industry were aged 25 - 32 (if i recall correctly), but you can go and check out the results yourself. On the topic of good places to learn web design, try and eat five a day from this selection.

 

CSS / HTML

 

http://www.alistapart.com/

http://www.tizag.com/

http://www.cssjuice.com/

http://www.htmldog.com/

http://www.simplebits.com/

http://mondaybynoon.com/

http://www.wpdfd.com/

http://24ways.org/

 

 

Design

 

http://www.smashingmagazine.com/

http://www.colourlovers.com/

http://www.pic2color.com/

http://ilovetypography.com/

http://www.bittbox.com/

 

Usability / Accessibility

 

http://www.webpagesthatsuck.com/

http://www.useit.com/alertbox/

(This tool Is for checking color contrasts for color blind viewers)

http://www.visionaustralia.org.au/info.aspx?page=628

^^ Sticky some of them? I use a lot of them, I must say out of them all Smashing Magazine especially is priceless (put it on your RSS)

I've just graduated with a 1st class honours in Digital Art & Technology... effectively new-media design. Give it 3-5 years, and everything I learned there will be obsolete.

 

You're never too-old to become great in design / development sectors. I've been designing and coding since I was 14, yet I know people who started out 2 years ago that can create absolutely kick-ass interfaces and back-ends.

 

Do remember that some developers and designers can be quite 'elitist' when they started at a young age. These are the same designers that think they are amazing at what they do.

 

Obviously, starting to play Football at 24 with hopes of becoming a professional are a bit hard stretched. However, some pro golfers are relatively old and only started playing in their 30s.

 

Don't listen to your mate Put the effort in, and you'll be up there. It's a lot easier to improve your skills nowadays with open-source culture.

I'm with everyone else, I've learned web design 3 times or so! I started when I was 12 and made basic pages with plain text, then I had to learn table layout and then most recently CSS layout. The same goes with code, when i was in school VB Script was acceptable to use, now it's JavaScript. CGI became PHP.. the list goes on.

 

Basically what I'm saying is that all web designers have to learn a bunch of new stuff every few years anyway, but it's the design skills that remain and stay strong!

There are designers, and there are good designers.

 

You're never too old to learn, and 24 certainly isn't old! 25 is though, 'cause then you're pushing 30.

 

Seriously, though, 24 is still really young. So what if you haven't quite had the "head start" that some people have? Doesn't mean you won't make it.

I may have gotten into web design at a young age (around 12), but I only learnt the really useful stuff that would actually earn me money and be of any use from the age of 20. It's only recently that things have started to really click and become polished. You're never too old, and to be honest I believe that the older you are the quicker you'll understand and get to grips with a skill. Young people tend to have a short attention span and don't understand the wider picture when doing something.

 

Good luck, don't listen to them!

reading this thread has made me feel my age

You're still too young. And you do have more time to learn and be a successful web designer. As long as you have the passion for designing and you have the determination to prove yourself that you can do it, just go for it. There's nothing impossible if you believe in yourself...

I feel such a geriatric now :-(

 

Good luck with your new career! I'm sure that there will be many things to challenge you (like finding work, building your business and at the same time learning) but I would be absolutely sure that your age will be no problem at all.

I started at 31, and never once considered my age to be an impediment; in fact, it's an asset. I'm realistic about my capabilities, motivated to do well, experienced enough to know that I'm well suited to it etc etc. The guy who told you that you're too old is an idiot. Tell him I said so!

Glad to see so many encouraging threads here. Yes, it takes time, but you don't need 10 years experience. The technology moves much more quickly than that. What you would have learned 10 years ago would be worth little or nothing today anyway.

 

Looking forward to seeing some of your work.

Thanks again for all your encouragement! It's just what I wanted to hear.

 

I'm looking forward to getting my teeth stuck into some projects now. I'll have to post some work on here for your 'constructive criticism'.

 

What a friendly bunch you are!

totoally off topic, but can anyone tell me what "10 a penny" means? I tried googling it and still have no idea

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Literally it means you can get 10 for a penny, but it's used to mean that there are a LOT of them, and many of them come cheap!

 

It also implies that their work can often be cheap (quality) even if their services aren't

 

Applies to plumbers, mechanics etc as well as designers. The good ones are rare even though there are hundreds of people in the industry.

Oh ok..I kind of get it. Hah I feel so dumb!

^^ a dime a dozen

Well I know this sentiment has now been conveyed a good 20 times, but I will just reitterate that what he said was a complete pile!

 

Specifically - I have a real problem with people that say "you've missed the boat" about ANY industry, because it's never true!

 

But more to the point, people these days will tell you that the web design market is satturated and everyone is outsourcing to india anyway, even my father who has been managing IT since the days of punch cards, and is more 'on the ball' than anyone else I know is of this opinion.

So how is it that I've NEVER had a 'dry patch' ? Every single site I've done has led to a recommendation and a new client.

 

BUT

 

When it comes to following an employed career path (IE not running your own business or working freelance), things are a little different

 

Web designers ARE 10 to the penny at the moment, and you'll rarely see a web designer position advertised, when you do they're almost always 15k junior positions where you don't actually get to make websites, you just support the 'real designers'.

 

Web developers however, is the opposite - PHP developers are more in demand than eternal life! I saw a listing just the other day for a PHP developer that was 40k+ and that wasn't even for a senior position.

The most money in development is in .NET - we're talking 100k+ salaries, and there's relatively high demand. I personally though would never work in it, as I've worked WITH it (seo) and it's a bloody nightmare, like any other Microsoft product.

Probably the most lucrative open source project to get into is Ruby on Rails, specs are being advertised at the moment for ROR projects for 60-80k, and we're not even talking really tricky stuff, just simple, stable, web apps.

 

Development will always make you the most cash (if that's what you want), and if you want a job in an office then I'd say learn PHP - if you're going to work for yourself then definitely consider Ruby.

Thanks guys!

 

I kinda new it wasn't too late for me, but it's always nice to hear it from people in the know.

 

Right - decision made then! Although I'm A+ and Network+ certified I think a different path is calling me.

 

Am I being realistic in being able to self-study at home? Are there any decent books, courses or websites (apart from this one! ) that I should look at as a 'study guide'?

 

Thanks again,

 

Nick.

I was also A+ and N+ certified and chose to do web design/development too. You are never too old.

Hi there

 

Everyone already covered what I am suppose to say. It's never too late to pursue something that you really want.

 

I heard of this story of an old guy who finished Law at the age of 73. Since then, I keep on bugging my 51 year old Dad to give it a try. It was his dream, and he wants me to be a lawyer instead, but I insisted on taking up Physics.

 

I first designed websites as a hobby back in 1998 (I was 17) using Netscape Editor and Microsoft Front Page Express, but my learning stops when I entered Junior college to focus on Physics stuff. Then, entered into a series of employment in the academe, none of them involved web design. It was just a year ago that my learning on web designing continued, and these CSS and SEO stuff are all new to me.

 

Enjoy the ride mate