November 13, 200817 yr Here is the deal in short. -Company has guy make website(no contracts). -Guy makes website and hosts it privately(on his personal server) -Guy gets fired. -Guy wants to charge $30/mo for hosting or a $175 transfer fee. -Company says no. They want to get someone else to do it. They want to just copy the source code. -Guy says, no you can't do that.(guessing its because of copyright) -Website has © 2008 Legends Distribution, LLC (company name, so wouldn't the rights belong to the company and not the guy?) -Company also has permission to use all images(not the guy). So, can I copy the source code for the company? Let me know if you need more info.
November 13, 200817 yr Welcome to WDF! That sounds a bit of a sticky one if there was no contract. I think you need to consult a solicitor who specialises in copywrite or company law.
November 13, 200817 yr Author hmm...well, I don't know anyone that can help me. I also don't have the time either.
November 13, 200817 yr The company might own the content and images but the guy could own the design and code, especially if there is no contract saying he doesn't, so he could turn around and say that you can't use his design and code without his permission...so the best thing you can do is as bluedreamer has said, speak to someone who specialises in copyright, as if you use it and this guy claims he owns the copyright of it then he could get the hosting company to stop the site displaying, or take you to court as well as this company. So even if you have no time, it is better to be safe than to be in a lot of trouble later on down the line.
November 13, 200817 yr ok I think... I dont know, but I think... as you are the designer, the creater, the author you are the copyright owner so long as it wasnt signed over. is there anyway you can prove it? you might want to seek advice asap, get in their 1st and you may be able to get the company to accidently say something they really dont want to say and admit you designed it which should be enought. or maybe you may already have an email which will confirm this??!?
November 14, 200817 yr Again... no legal expert here. But when you say "no contract" that might not necessarily be true. It's not clear from your original post if the 'guy' was an employee of the company or a freelancer. If he was an employee then the copyright of the design is going to be the company's. If he was a freelancer - was he paid, are there emails or other evidence that he undertook this job for the company? If the company paid him then there is a contract - you don't need to sign anything to form a contract, even verbal is enough (you just need to be able to prove it). If it's in some way complex or the guy won't budge then it seems to me to be a case of Contract Law and Tort and nothing to do with copyright. Oh, and I'm glad to see I've messed with your mind Bluedreamer ("a solicitor who specialises in copywrite")!!!
November 14, 200817 yr If company/client paid designer for website, designer has no rights to anything and should hand over the website, domain and all associated files. Its simple, if you sell your services you cannot just whine and blackmail people because you got fired.
November 14, 200817 yr Author Ok, here are a few things. -I'm not sure if they guy was employeed. Its really weird. He was given a giftcard for his services. But photographers are also paid for their services and they don't hand over the rights. So paid or not they could still be his. If he was an employee I'm sure the company would have the rights. Photographers that work for a studio don't have rights but the studio does. This is tough though. -It is illegal to put "Copyright of John Doe" if John doe doesn't own it. The designer that made the site and is claiming rights put that there. So its kinda contradicting. -Final point, the layout looks very similar. There are a few changes that make boxes a few pixels different but not noticable. The biggest thing is the code(not the looks). He used PHP...I didn't. I just used HTML.
November 15, 200817 yr He was given a giftcard for his services [...] If he was given anything for his services then I'm sure that forms a contract. In tort a contract is valid if there was "adequate but not necessarily sufficient consideration" - which means if you give me your £100,000 Ferrari for free it doesn't form a contract but if you sell it to me for £10 then it is (the £10 is adequate, it doesn't matter it was insufficient). Therefore the company would own anything the guy produced for that job. Sure they might not have rights on the images and might have to source them themselves or get different ones.
November 15, 200817 yr Oh, and I'm glad to see I've messed with your mind Bluedreamer ("a solicitor who specialises in copywrite")!!! Oh *&(*&%&$^&$ I've been rumbled... What I meant to say was "specialises in copy, write?", err hold on, no, you'll see through that one, damn, it's my keyboard you know, the keys keep swapping places and my fingers can't keep up, shoot... ok, hands up... at least it proves I'm human, and I err sometimes :lol
November 15, 200817 yr Oh *&(*&%&$^&$ I've been rumbled... What I meant to say was "specialises in copy, write?", err hold on, no, you'll see through that one, damn, it's my keyboard you know, the keys keep swapping places and my fingers can't keep up, shoot... ok, hands up... at least it proves I'm human, and I err sometimes :lol It's not that you're making typing errors - it's that I'm subliminally programming all of you to think of copywriting all the time!!!! Now, look into my eyes for just a moment...
November 15, 200817 yr It's not that you're making typing errors - it's that I'm subliminally programming all of you to think of copywriting all the time!!!!Now, look into my eyes for just a moment... [staring and waiting...]
November 15, 200817 yr [staring and waiting...] Now you're making me feel like a penguin in a polar bear convention... big long paws and everyone staring! That's comedy gold that is - I made that joke up all by myself, bet you couldn't tell!
November 15, 200817 yr If the designer were an employee of the company, the copyright belongs to the company. If he/she were a freelancer, the copyright for the design belongs to the designer. That's the kind've 'default' ownership status if there's no contract or other agreement that negates it. Payment to a freelancer, whether by gift certificate or whatever, doesn't change this - payment, again by 'default' is for useage, not ownership, so it would be considered to be payment for the useage of the design. The actual design still belongs to the designer (assuming they weren't working for the company as an employee). With regards to the copyright notice, in my opinion it's not a factor. The notice does not itself confer copyright ownership, it is a notice to say who the copyright owners are. Still, you could argue that it implies that there was an agreement for the company to own all rights to the completed design but without a contract, I doubt that would count for much. Basically, if the designer did the work as anything other than an employee of the company, you need to prove what the terms of the agreement were. A contract would normally be the way to do this, but you could do it by providing supporting emails or other correspondence if they mention terms/rights etc.
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