[NeRo]

I was a huge fan of Firefox, but just recently I've found it getting slower. As a result, I decided to give Chrome a go - it seems I'm not alone ..

Chrome No2 of UK's top browsers

[MikeChipshop]

Well it's my browser of choice.

[Aaron_WebDev]

Yup, love Chrome and have always used it!

[Chosen]

I'm staying loyal to Firefox. The add-ons and neverendless styles/skins are way too superior.

[MikeChipshop]

Chosen, on 01 August 2011 - 12:19 PM, said:

I'm staying loyal to Firefox. The add-ons and neverendless styles/skins are way too superior.

Agrre with the add-ons, however the reason i stopped using Firefox was it was becoming bloated and it's to easy for plug-in developers to create buggy wasted scripts that hog up all the memory.

Skins though... come on, do you actually use them?
Chrome skins are just as pointless though.

[Alluziion]

MikeChipshop, on 01 August 2011 - 12:23 PM, said:

Agrre with the add-ons, however the reason i stopped using Firefox was it was becoming bloated and it's to easy for plug-in developers to create buggy wasted scripts that hog up all the memory.

Skins though... come on, do you actually use them?
Chrome skins are just as pointless though.

The W3C Browser Statistics seem to tell a similar story.

I agree with you Mike.
FireFox plug-ins are function although resourceful.
And skins are just messy - I also see a slight performance decrease when using FF skins on a weaker computer.

Chrome is by far faster than IE and FF although it does seem to have some strange random memory leaks it remains lightweight and clean; I think it has a bright future.

This post has been edited by Alluziion: 14 August 2011 - 02:17 PM

[Renaissance-Design]

Firefox 5 is nice and fast, and I don't think there's anything out there as comprehensive as Firebug.

[Alluziion]

Renaissance-Design, on 14 August 2011 - 02:17 PM, said:

Firefox 5 is nice and fast, and I don't think there's anything out there as comprehensive as Firebug.

I love Firebug.
In fact, Firebug is the only time I ever use FireFox (other than for testing site compatibility).

[andyl]

Some of you web developers still using Firefox?! Gosh!

Chrome/Safari - lightweight, unbeatably fast, utilise webkit.
Firefox - about as bloated as OEM Windows, slow to load the actual app (ridiculously so for Mac users), comparable to IE.

Claiming Gecko is better, or more compatible, than WebKit ... still? Pfft, apparently Mozilla aren't aware of the ever-increasing tablet/mobile market, or their ever-decreasing market share. They've dug the grave for FF, now let it RIP.

As for Firebug, right-click -> inspect element, or Firebug Lite.

[Ste Hughes]

I changed from firefox 2 months ago.

fire fox 4 was a bloody fail - Its never been stable and on average it freezes up 2/3 times a day.

it uses 300k of memory which may not be a lot but my little PC struggled a little when I had FF, photoshop + itunes or what ever open.

Chrome uses 30-50k of memory - Other than the very rare flash issue I have not had a single problem with it. its superb and lovely to use. Its not crashed or closed for me once yet.

Firefox needs a major redo though - It could be I had few add ons installed or what ever but the latest versions have been horrible.

[brightonmike]

Chrome only uses 50k of memory? Sniff, sniff, what's that I smell?

[Renaissance-Design]

andyl, on 14 August 2011 - 03:15 PM, said:

As for Firebug, right-click -> inspect element, or Firebug Lite.

Calm down. Firstly, Chrome's element inspector and Firebug Lite lack functionality vs full Firebug - the closest thing is actually Opera's Dragonfly.

With the FirePHP plugin for Firebug you can log debug messages directly to the Firebug console.

[MikeChipshop]

Firebug Lite is a pretty shameless version of Firbug on Firefox. Very feature lacking but not a lot they can do about it.

[Alluziion]

Ste Hughes, on 14 August 2011 - 05:27 PM, said:

Chrome uses 30-50k of memory - Other than the very rare flash issue I have not had a single problem with it. its superb and lovely to use. Its not crashed or closed for me once yet.

I love Chrome but with a few tabs open I'm on upto 500k.
I got 2 tabs open now and I'm on 150k.
But I may be one of the unlucky ones who is suffering from the "random" memory leak that was supposed to be fixed

This post has been edited by Alluziion: 15 August 2011 - 10:36 AM

[andyl]

Renaissance-Design, on 15 August 2011 - 10:01 AM, said:

Calm down. Firstly, Chrome's element inspector and Firebug Lite lack functionality vs full Firebug - the closest thing is actually Opera's Dragonfly.

With the FirePHP plugin for Firebug you can log debug messages directly to the Firebug console.

I'm quite calm thank you, even before your condescending comment. No, it doesn't have all of the features, inspect element has the useful features of Firebug.

As you can see, all but 2 people (1 of them yourself) in this thread of web developers is moving, or has moved, from Firefox. I now have to do extra work for Firefox if I push forward with new technologies - HTML 5 and CSS 3 mainly (or at least what Firefox supports of them).

From my perspective, it's a dying browser. The statistics say the same, my friends and colleagues say the same, and this bunch of developers say the same. Using Firefox purely because of Firebug is, in my opinion, a waste. There's other things in this world.

Stay calm. Move on.

This post has been edited by andyl: 20 August 2011 - 09:57 AM

[joshfolio]

i would rather use Firefox that has a decent tool like firebug that helps, than use chrome just cause its slightly faster and uses slightly less memory.

just my opinion

[Renaissance-Design]

I'd disagree with most of your assertions. The ability to extend Firebug with things like FirePHP and FireUnit is very useful to me, and as such there's nothing to compare with Firefox as a development tool.

Firefox has just moved from a waterfall release schedule to an agile schedule like Chrome. It will catch up on CSS3 features, but the stuff that Webkit supports and Gecko doesn't is mostly bleeding-edge stuff that's subject to change before it gets locked down into a standard. That being so, it shouldn't be included in a baseline you're designing to and then working around.

It sounds very much ike you're racing to use the newest technologies and techniques without using the newest methodologies that go along with them: progressive enhancement is the way to go, not graceful degradation. In a world where IE6-8 still has market share, I refuse to believe you're being specifically held back by Firefox 5 and 6.

It's all down to the users. If the userbase for a project is largely going to be in a corporate environment (using some version of IE behind the latest release, possibly with Javascript disabled by policy) it doesn't make sense to use HTML5 and CSS3 at all.

I'm in no position to talk about the speed, stability or memory usage of Chrome vs Firefox on a Mac, of course. It could be that the OSX version is lacking compared to Chrome, but on my Win7 machines it's not enough of a disparity to make me want to switch.

In closing, perhaps my tone was a little condescending - but then, so was this:

andyl, on 14 August 2011 - 03:15 PM, said:

Some of you web developers still using Firefox?! Gosh!

[andyl]

Let's just agree to disagree.

I prefer Safari/Chrome because they're raising the bar. Mozilla are sitting, waiting to be told what's next. That didn't used to be the case. I personally think Mozilla are starting to struggle - but who wouldn't with a monster like Google greedy for your market. Firefox 5 came out 3 months after Firefox 4, then Firefox 6 only 2 months after that - it all looks a bit desperate.

They're losing share to Chrome, steadily. It cannot be put more simply. If you like it, you like it, but if it carries on at this rate, by the time Firefox 10 comes around (maybe next month?) I seriously doubt it'll have much going for it.

PS. By 'IE6-8 has market share', I assume you mean it has a reasonable share, not majority share?

[roothost]

I have to say, after upgrading my Firefox to v6 2 days ago I am seriously looking at making Chrome my default browser. Maybe it's my machine but as of late, FF has gotten very sluggish and quite often crashes

[WBC]

Maybe it's just the way I roll but I don't use one browser I use three at a the same time. IE, Chrome and Firefox. No need to change, choose or fuss. In the end there isn't going to be one crowned the winner.

But unfortunately there has to be a loser, Safari come on down! IE may make people put effort into design, Firefox may freeze and Chrome may leak but not being able to copy an address into the address bar, come on!

[brightonmike]

Renaissance-Design, on 20 August 2011 - 11:12 AM, said:

progressive enhancement is the way to go, not graceful degradation

They are both, essentially, two sides of the same coin and it is impossible to do only one and not the other. *cough* alt tag *cough*.

[andyl]

WBC, on 21 August 2011 - 11:49 PM, said:

not being able to copy an address into the address bar, come on!

Can you not copy and paste in Safari on Win?! I certainly can on OS X.

[zed]

nope, you can't you have to put a space after anything you've pasted.

[mrchristoph]

I tend to use Firefox and Chrome at the same time. I found that Firefox was running really slowly a few times and followed this post and it fixed it. Somehow nothing quite beats the actual Firebug:

http://labnol.blogsp...emory-fast.html

[oakleaves]

Interesting thread. Always thought most web guys were die-hard firefox fans.

Been using Chrome for a while, didn't realise it had become that popular though I must admit. I personally like the view source / developer tools on Chrome and the fact the browser isn't too intrusive.

To be fair to firefox, Google came along and basically looked at what was considered the best browser at the time - firefox - and tried to improve on it.. and I think they succeeded.

[Malick]

andyl, on 14 August 2011 - 03:15 PM, said:

Some of you web developers still using Firefox?! Gosh!

Chrome/Safari - lightweight, unbeatably fast, utilise webkit.
Firefox - about as bloated as OEM Windows, slow to load the actual app (ridiculously so for Mac users), comparable to IE.

Claiming Gecko is better, or more compatible, than WebKit ... still? Pfft, apparently Mozilla aren't aware of the ever-increasing tablet/mobile market, or their ever-decreasing market share. They've dug the grave for FF, now let it RIP.

As for Firebug, right-click -> inspect element, or Firebug Lite.

You, sir, are very confrontational
Maybe not intentionally, but you definitely get people a little over-agitated from the way you word things. This point of view is based off of this thread and that other Windows vs Mac thread where you and some other guy got into a big discussion about which you prefer.
Not trying to start anything, just thought I'd point it out. Don't hate me for it

I personally use Firefox. I love chrome though! I use Firefox because it has more add-ons. Simple as that. They make browsing easier for me and I like them. I don't even have firebug 'cause it slows Firefox waaaaaaay down. But what I'm trying to say is Firefox isn't dying out, it's awesome and Chrome isn't a feature-less piece of junk, it's awesome, too!

But still, I use Firefox for my day to day browsing...

[Gibson]

Renaissance-Design, on 20 August 2011 - 11:12 AM, said:

progressive enhancement is the way to go, not graceful degradation.

This.

brightonmike, on 22 August 2011 - 09:11 AM, said:

They are both, essentially, two sides of the same coin and it is impossible to do only one and not the other. *cough* alt tag *cough*.

I see what you mean - Though do you not think that the choice of which way to go might affect the way in which a project was structured and executed in some cases?

[Gibson]

Malick, on 03 September 2011 - 07:31 PM, said:

You, sir, are very confrontational

He's a Mac user.


andy - Just joshing with ya you also have some good points.

[brightonmike]

Gibson, on 03 September 2011 - 08:34 PM, said:

This.




I see what you mean - Though do you not think that the choice of which way to go might affect the way in which a project was structured and executed in some cases?

Possibly.

My problem with progressive enhancement with web development is it often encourages, and almost actively promotes, basing a project on old technologies, methods & practices that are often horribly out of touch.

It's swings and roundabouts really, and of course, it depends entirely on your audience. If only 2% of people visiting your website are using IE6/7, then coding from the ground up to work for those, then adding on to that code fancy bits to make it look a bit nicer in newer browsers, would of course be nonsense. But that's progressive enhancement.

I say, you should ground up for the overwhelming majority. Then add whatever you need to extend support.

Whether that means graceful degradation (coding for Chrome, but adding IE stylesheets to make it work in IE8) or progressive enhancement (coding for IE8, then adding fancy CSS3 for Chrome) is kind of irrelevant.

That's only my methodology. I guess everybodys will be different. The main thing is that for the vast majority, the site works.

This post has been edited by brightonmike: 03 September 2011 - 09:39 PM

[rallport]

NeRo, on 01 August 2011 - 10:21 AM, said:

I was a huge fan of Firefox, but just recently I've found it getting slower. As a result, I decided to give Chrome a go - it seems I'm not alone ..

Chrome No2 of UK's top browsers

A browser doesn't just mysteriously "get slower"

What plugins do you have installed? How many tabs do you have open at the same time? For instance, at work I noticed there was a random plugin running in the background that automatically downloaded site media, such as Youtube videos et al. Needless to say this made browsing pretty choppy. Disbaling this soon speeded everything back up again.

On my computer everything is very snappy even with my 26 tabs constantly open, am using FF 8.0.

[rallport]

andyl, on 14 August 2011 - 03:15 PM, said:

Claiming Gecko is better, or more compatible, than WebKit ... still? Pfft, apparently Mozilla aren't aware of the ever-increasing tablet/mobile market, or their ever-decreasing market share. They've dug the grave for FF, now let it RIP.

Not sure what everyone keeps goijng on about this slow loading in FF? As said, I have 26 saved tabs in FF 8.0 - from double clicking on my FF icon I have a useable browsers within 4-5 seconds.

All I've done is being sensible in what plugins I have installed and changed a couple of values in about:config

Also, do you have a source for Mozilla giving up on FF?

[andyl]

rallport, on 13 November 2011 - 07:26 PM, said:

Not sure what everyone keeps goijng on about this slow loading in FF? As said, I have 26 saved tabs in FF 8.0 - from double clicking on my FF icon I have a useable browsers within 4-5 seconds.

All I've done is being sensible in what plugins I have installed and changed a couple of values in about:config

Also, do you have a source for Mozilla giving up on FF?

4-5 seconds is quite a long time for a browser IMO. Safari boots in under a second for me, Chrome in just over 1 second. Admittedly I don't save tabs, but it's different on a Mac due to the nature of closing/quitting apps. Photoshop takes less than 5 seconds for me - on a cold boot - why would I wait 5-10 seconds for an old browser to load?

I never said they've given up with it? They're releasing versions like no tomorrow at the moment to try and catch up with at least IE. Consumers (non-techie) would have seen Firefox 4 and IE 10. 10 > 4 therefore IE > Firefox. Google got themselves sorted with version control from day 1; no-one (again, non-techies) knows what version of Chrome they run - they just say 'Yeh I use Chrome'. As for Safari, well...I don't think it's amazing, nor would I recommend it to Windows users, but jeez is it fast on OS X.

Firefox *used to be* noticeably slower on Mac than Windows - I'm not sure if they've sorted this yet, nor do I intend on finding out!

PS. 26 tabs?!

This post has been edited by andyl: 13 November 2011 - 07:47 PM

[brightonmike]

Chrome loads pretty much instantly for me. I'm not sure how you've managed to distinguish between a browser that load in just under a second, and one that loads in just over a second - mind you!

[andyl]

No I meant Safari and Chrome are fast, I was distinguishing those two from Firefox!

[brightonmike]

I mean this bit

Safari boots in under a second for me, Chrome in just over 1 second

I'm just kidding with you really

[RobbieD90]

I use Chrome for what it's worth!

I found FF was becoming worse with every update/version (although if their was an opposite of update I would of used that instead!)

I have had no issues what so ever with Chrome, in the last year or so I have been using it. Compared to FF which crashed endlessly through out an average day. I think Google have done a smashing job with Chrome where has Mozilla don't even seem to bother trying and are letting FF slip down the pecking order without any fight what so ever.