[ricrod]

So you’re sitting comfortably, I’ll begin. Well it is a forum…

Image Rights are a big issue as everyone knows but have they caused you a problem. About two years ago I have to admit I fell fowl of this issue with a client. They supplied an image for their web site from their marketing agency and I believed it was theirs and not from elsewhere. The client wanted the image for their new website and so I obliged.

Some months later a letter arrived demanding i) payment for the image use and, ii) removal of the image. So Hey How a bill and no further use of the image. Wow! Cool business I thought. Anyway the matter was duly settled and the small fee was dealt with by the client but I started looking into the matter further.

I’m curious who is aware of the following:

• A major company in Israel is currently being paid to store a copy of every web site on the Internet.
• The major image sellers pay for this and use the results to bill unsuspecting individuals and companies.
• The company ignore and bypass all control files e.g. Robtots.txt .htaccess , e.t.c.
• An image on the internet even if not directly accessible from a web site, i.e. ‘images/’ is still available to see.

I have shared this with different web designers and companies and now manage all images strictly but of the people I have spoken to three volunteered their experience of this matter.

One “Full Service Digital Agency” had more to say than most. Let’s just say that the demand financially in the letter they received would have bought a new small hatchback. Their story was amazing!

They are a fairly large team and one of their designers had built a site for, let’s say a financial services company. The site was duly completed and launched but unbeknown to the agency the designer had kept a duplicate copy of the site within the same domain and changed six key images to high quality, high resolution and dramatic photos. It transpired that this was for his own portfolio and C.V. Naturally it wasn’t until sometime later when the letter arrived that this information came to light.

So what’s in your Image closet on the web?

[RobertG]

It is only illegal to use the image, if you are not using.. ie = sharing (you are sharing just by having on the website as people can download it) the image there is no copyright issues. If the image is within a folder which has a no-index robot file attached and the images are not on your website you are not breaking any laws!

But as your article says, if you are using even as a portfolio you are in-fact breaching copyright laws as you are passing the work as your own and unless you have image rights you are in breach.

[WebDev_Tank]

So if i made a PSD mock up with an image of say a car on it i found on google, is this breaking copy right laws if i put it in my portfolio???

[asek]

It really depends, with cars, unless it is a spy photo, manufacturers do not mind too much, as I assume you are not claiming to have built the car etc.

[ricrod]

Hi and thanks for the comments. A little uncertain about your part about "sharing" above. Just to explain further all content on any web site is available to the company I mentioned before who ignore all "noindex" or similar information. They retrieve a copy of every part of the website which cannot be prevented and then match images to stock file. No images or content can be blocked from this particular company and if there, then they take action for not having a licence. If an image can be viewed via an http request e.g. http://www.asite.com...ofsomething.jpg they will pursue this despite it not being embedded with the web site.

[winjeel]

Which major image sellers? To use an analogy, what's wrong with hiring patent lawyers to go out hunting for other companies that use your patented technology without your permission and no royalties?

Another way to look at it is if I put a banana in my pocket, is that illegal? What if I were in a supermarket, I haven't paid for the banana, and I put it in my pocket, is that illegal? Now, if I put an unpaid-for banana in my pocket, and then walk out of the supermarket, is that illegal? RobertG suggests that if you don't use the image, then it's ok. So, if I've walked out of the supermarket with an unpaid-for banana in my pocket, is it only illegal if I use... err... eat the banana?

I'm starting to worry that adult colleges and universities in the UK aren't teaching their graduates about copyright and avoiding trouble, but more importantly, doing the right and respectful thing. Let's turn this around, is it ok for me to use your webdesigns without your permission and without paying? What if it's just for a company intranet, and it's not public, as someone seems to suggest that it's ok because it cannot be publicly found. I've taken photos that have cost a considerable amount of money to accomplish, but no where near the cost that some photographers might spend for a contracted shoot (which can cost upto and possibly over USD$10,000). How much does it cost you guys to make a web design? It's just colours and graphics, right?

I don't intend to start any heated debates (and I will ignore them anyway). But please think a bit more about showing respect to owners of photos, and I'm sure you expect the same respect from the general public for your work, too.

One more thing, I have "free stock images" here, and please note the second last point in the FAQ at the bottom of the page.

[RobertG]

ricrod, on 24 October 2010 - 02:04 PM, said:

Hi and thanks for the comments. A little uncertain about your part about "sharing" above.

Anything which you can view on your website you are sharing! (thats what i mean). as people are downloading anytyhing they are viewing.

ricrod, on 24 October 2010 - 02:04 PM, said:

Just to explain further all content on any web site is available to the company I mentioned before who ignore all "noindex" or similar information. They retrieve a copy of every part of the website which cannot be prevented and then match images to stock file. No images or content can be blocked from this particular company and if there, then they take action for not having a licence. If an image can be viewed via an http request e.g. http://www.asite.com...ofsomething.jpg they will pursue this despite it not being embedded with the web site.

This is wrong....

a company can not by any means take legal action!...

Anyone can copy an image for personal use - the illegal issue is sharing or selling!

If you are selling the image without image rights you are breaking the law...

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If you have the image on the website that people can access this is sharing as everything is downloaded by peoples computers when they view your website.... This is breaking the law....

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Putting something on your server for personal use and not sharing or selling, in a folder which is not accessible to robots and visitors is not illegal - Well not in the EU anyway.

I would tell your clients they are being ripped off. But if it is on there website for all to see then its up to them to pay or replace.

[RobertG]

winjeel, on 25 October 2010 - 01:55 PM, said:

Another way to look at it is if I put a banana in my pocket, is that illegal? What if I were in a supermarket, I haven't paid for the banana, and I put it in my pocket, is that illegal? Now, if I put an unpaid-for banana in my pocket, and then walk out of the supermarket, is that illegal? RobertG suggests that if you don't use the image, then it's ok. So, if I've walked out of the supermarket with an unpaid-for banana in my pocket, is it only illegal if I use... err... eat the banana?

Image copyrights are not like taking a fruit from a supermarket...

Dont get me wrong i wish it was as i have had images stole on the internet before...

The reason i know about copying an image to your computer for say a wall paper is not illegal is because when i tried to get compensation for the stolen image i was told nothing can be done..

As for storing on server...

Some people use there server for backup files on there computers.. They can just say its a backup.

Its like a DVD.

You cant get done for having a backup of a dvd but you can get done for selling that copy!


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also how many of you look at a creative image on the internet for inspiration?

How many people pull that image off the internet so that you can see it within Photoshop while you are using inspiration?

OR

how about this!!

WHen you go to a website... you are breaking the law as your computer is downloading and saving that image!!!

Copyright laws is nothing like stealing fruit!

[porcelain]

it's all very complicated